Mike and Nick interview Jon Kaplowitz, the CEO and co-founder of Clubs Poker, the the hottest new US social online poker room where players can redeem their winnings at the poker tables for real money prizes.

From the backstory to how to get started playing on Clubs Poker, the guys get the info straight from the source. They also discuss the player experience on the app, the games and features available, the road ahead and more.

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Full Transcript

Mike Gentile: Hello and welcome everybody to the Pokerfuse podcast. I’m your host, Mike Gentile, along with my co-host, Nick Jones.

Today on the pod, we’re joined by Clubs Poker co-founder and CEO, Jon Kaplowitz.

As a matter of full disclosure, I wanted to let our listeners know that Pokerfuse is a marketing partner of Clubs Poker. After listening to this podcast, we hope you’ll understand why we’ve put our trust in this company. Jon, thanks for joining us. It’s great to have you here. For those unfamiliar, Jon, why don’t you tell us a little bit about your role at Clubs Poker and your background in iGaming?

Jon Kaplowitz: Yes, absolutely. Again, thanks, Mike and Nick, for having me on the pod. I’ve always loved poker my entire life. I spent half my childhood in Las Vegas. My grandparents lived there. My grandma, who was a dealer at the Landmark Casino in Vegas, if any old-school folks know that one, she taught me how to play poker. I fell in love with it when I was four years old.

When I was 21, I spent my 21st birthday at the Mirage Poker Room and actually hit a royal flush and a Straight Flush the same day. I was playing 1-5, 7 card stud because there was no no limit at that point. I haven’t hit a royal flush or straight flush since at the poker room, but this is in my blood. When I was 28, I got my dream job at World Poker Tour, working with Steve Lipscomb, who is the creator of WPT, working with Adam Pliska, who currently is the CEO of WPT. He was the general counsel at the time. What a dream job, walking around building WPT to what it is today. I always had that in my blood.

Mike: What did you do there, Jon, at WPT?

Jon: I ran a business development. My job was to expand the brand throughout the world. Myself and my partner, Lawrence Glinsky, literally we’d go to crazy countries like Austria. We spent a couple of years in China, building the WPT China. It was a 15-city tour throughout all the different provinces in mainland China. This was 2006, 2007. Just incredible experience.

Obviously, there were some challenges that happened during that time as well with the Unlawful Internet Gaming Enforcement Act and others. It really not only helped me professionally, but it made me realize that if I ever do have a job, I want to do it in something like this, something that I love. Then moving forward in my career, I spent a few years at Comcast NBC Universal, where myself and my team, we were responsible for new businesses.

One of the new businesses that we were trying to create was this sports betting business at the dawn of sports betting in 2017, 2018, when Pasco was overturned. What that led to was a relationship with Penn National Gaming. I became the CEO of Penn Interactive and was there for three years, build from the ground up, the Barstool Sportsbook and Casino, really just got an incredible experience in how to build and operate a regulated gaming company.

After three years, I needed a break. I also wanted to do something very entrepreneurial as well. That’s when my new company, Clubs Poker, which I know we’ll talk about today, was birthed. I took all my love and passions, everything that I learned from the regulated space and poured it into what is now Clubs Poker.

Nick Jones: That’s quite the resume going into the role you’re in now. Could you just talk a bit about Clubs Poker as a company, how long it’s been around, how big your team is, where you’re based, that kind of that thing?

Jon: Yes. Clubs Poker, we incorporated the company last year, last summer. We actually launched publicly on July 1st of this year. It’s been two months since we’ve been live. We have a team of 28 folks, basically all over the world, best of the best from product to poker operations, to game integrity, all the way to core operations as well. When I say core operations, that’s customer service, that’s know your customer, AML, anti-money laundering. We’re a small yet efficient company. I’m based here basically in Philadelphia, 10 minutes away from Philadelphia, and my co-founders are here in America as well.

Mike: Why did you create Clubs Poker?

Jon: I was a big-time online poker player back in the early aughts. I loved it. When those choices were removed for me in the later 2000s, I always wanted that same experience where I can play a classic game of online poker, a tournament with folks across the country. That was just missing for me. I go and visit my mother-in-law in Florida, and I’m like, “How can I just emulate the experience that I had when I was in my 20s?”

That’s really when the idea of Clubs Poker was born. What we are is one of America’s premier national online poker platforms. We’re in 44 states today. We have national liquidity. We have all the ring games you can imagine, 28 game variants, obviously all the classic games, but then all the games that my dad who’s 81 and still plays poker every week with his buddies play, those Deuce to Seven Triple Draw games, Badugi, Baduci, we have all those.

We really wanted to create a product that we would want to play. That’s who our customer was. We really thought if we thought this product was great and we were going to spend our time with it, we think that the general poker-playing public at large, the casual poker player would love to play it too. After two months, we’re really excited about the feedback that we’ve been getting and the people who are playing on our platform.

Mike: For our listeners, Clubs Poker is a social online poker site or a sweepstakes online poker site. Can you tell us a bit more about that?

Jon: Yes. We are a social casino. If you think about social casinos that exist today, it’s a big industry. You have companies like Playtika, Play Studios, these are public companies on the NASDAQ. That’s who we are with two distinct differences. Let’s talk about the social casino aspect. The overwhelming majority of our players are free players. They come in, we give them gold coins, that’s our retail currency if you will, and they just play for fun. They play in our ring games, they play in our tournaments.

If they run out of those coins, we give them new coins. They never have to pay for them. The unique distinction, and there are two, the first is we provide a promotional currency called sweepstakes currency. It’s essentially a ticket that somebody can have and win real cash and/or prizes. Now you can’t purchase this. We need to give it to you. We give it to you in a few ways.

As an incentive to purchase our gold coin packages, we have a daily bonus where we give away both gold coins, which is our free currency, and sweeps coins, which is our promotional currency. We also, like all sweepstakes companies in the world, have what’s called alternative method of entry, where you can just write in a postcard to us and we give you free sweepstakes tickets or sweepstakes currencies.

What you can do with that sweepstakes currency is you can play that up, play it through in the sweepstakes portion of our platform, and then redeem that for cash and/or prizes. Again, very similar to social casino with the very unique distinction that we have this redemption mechanic. There’s been some conflation in the industry. People are like, “Oh, that’s the sweepstakes industry.” We’re not the sweepstakes industry. We’re a social casino with one unique way to redeem what is a promotional currency.

That basically adds a lot of value to customers. It’s a really cool value proposition and I think customers really love it, which is why this industry has grown significantly over the last three or four years. The other distinct difference between us and a traditional social casino 1.0 is that we bring everything that we’ve learned from the regulated world to this social casino world. What I’m talking about is responsible gaming.

We have one of the best-in-class responsible gaming tools for our customers because whether you’re playing a social casino, whether you’re playing Xbox, responsible gaming is an issue. We have tools where people can take a break during their playing day. They can set self-exclusion limits for them a day, a week, forever. These are things that are very important for us and we’ve instilled into our product. The second thing is we call it KYC, know your customer tools.

It is very important to us that if you are under 18, you cannot play. We want to make sure that we essentially identify and eradicate bad actors from coming into and playing on our platform. I was there, I built the regulated gaming products and I can tell you that we have, again, best-in-class KYC tools, procedures. We work with the best third parties who also work with regulated sportsbooks and casinos as well.

I would call us social casino 2.0. We are a social casino, but we are a little bit more dynamic in terms of this redemption mechanic as well as some of our RG and KYC tools.

Nick: Just to jump in there, because I think a lot of our listeners, people listen to this podcast and read our stuff before, we write a lot about real money, regulated online poker, and casino games. I think a lot of people might be listening and thinking, “Is this too good to be true?”

You’re a nationwide social poker site available in 45 states in the US, but you can play and redeem these coins for real money. That’s a prize that you can get. I think a lot of people just might be like, “There’s lots of shady offshore sites,” something that we strongly recommend people don’t play on, unregulated sites. Can you just like explain in the clearest terms possible, why players can trust you, why you’re different from maybe some of the shady sites that we have recommended people don’t play on in the past, and just where you fit into that dynamic?

Jon: Let me try to break that question— break it up. Why can players trust us? We get to earn trust. You earn trust through your product being great, your customer service being great. In our world, if you are redeeming your coins, those redemptions are happening very quickly. You are providing the right tools for people if they want to embrace our responsible gaming tools.

Our game integrity is there and we have a great game integrity team as well. Some of the folks who run PokerStars game integrity as well. These are all areas where we aspire to be the best and, time will tell if our consumers think that as well, but that is our ultimate mission, to provide the best product for our consumers and then they continue to spend some time with us. You mentioned in terms of the offshore companies, Nick.

Look, I can talk about our company. We’re an American-based company. We’re a Delaware corporation. My co-founders have considerable experience in the gaming industry. One of my co-founders built DraftKings Sportsbook. Another one was my number two, and the COO at Penn Interactive. Our other co-founder, who’s our CTO, built and sold very successful social casino platforms. Again, we live here in America and our goal is to provide the best product for the American population, which we are based in right now.

Finally, to your point, you mentioned it’s too good to be true. You can play on Zynga. With players across America. You can go to a couple of other social casinos and they do redeem special points for prizes, whether that’s hotel rooms and/or other types of goodies. Cruises, have you not. I’ve seen a billion sweepstakes promotions where, “Hey, you do this and we’re going to—” in the gaming world where you do this and we give away stuff.

You go to McDonald’s, and if you want to play the Monopoly game, you can either buy a Big Mac or you can write in on a meal card and get some of those Monopoly pieces so you can get boardwalk. I think in any industry, there’s always going to be innovation. What I love about our industry and the companies who came before us and what we’re trying to do as well is we have social casino and now I think it’s very innovative.

It’s a step change in innovation to take what is a state legal mechanic, which is, “Hey, you have sweepstakes. You have these promotional activities and you apply it to a social casino.” Nothing changes. You still have that social casino. It still looks and feels like a social casino. Overwhelming majority are free. You just apply what has been used both in the gaming industry as well as multiple industries, this unique mechanic that I think has resonated with consumers. Again, I think that’s why you’ve seen a significant growth in this industry.

Mike: Interesting. For listeners that maybe are not even familiar with traditional online poker, walk them through the process of how they even get started. They go to Pokerfuse, they see Clubs Poker advertised, they click through to Clubs Poker and what do they need to do to start playing at the tables where they can win or they can convert their winnings into real money?

Jon: Again, we’re a social casino, so it’s literally one-step player. Again, it’s important to level-set folks here because I think, again, in the industry, we’ve conflated sweepstakes with something that’s different. Like every other social casino, all you need to do for us in our world is either verify your email and/or you can go through either Google or Facebook authentication. You click it and you’re there. You’re playing in our gold coins, our free mode. That’s it.

We give you coins to start playing and you just start playing. You do not have to go through a whole rigamarole of registration, KYC, putting any purchase information down, not at all. You just go and you play. As I said earlier, the overwhelming majority of our players are just free players. However, if you do want to participate in our sweepstakes side of the platform, then you have to do a couple of other things.

Number one, we need to verify you. We need to verify that you are 18 plus. You got to click on a couple of buttons there. You got to verify your mobile phone number like every other gaming company alike. The reason we do that is we have a poker site and you’re playing peer-to-peer. We want to make sure that there’s one phone number per person. We don’t want multi-accounting people to have two seats at one table.

Then as you go through our process and get closer to playing at sweepstakes, we make you even verify more stuff. Then finally, if you want to redeem, we go through a KYC check to make sure that you’re not using our platform for any fraudulent activity. What we’ve done— I think this is not innovative just to us, but because we’re a social casino, we have the opportunity to get people in to try and play for free with limited friction.

If they want to start playing and participating and, hopefully, getting those sweepstakes coins and potentially redeeming them, they need to go through some other, I’ll call it things, that helps us validate and verify who they are.

Mike: Those other things, again, if I’m unfamiliar, how do I purchase gold coins to get some free sweeps coins to start playing in games so that I can—

Jon: Similar to any other, call it, online digital product, we have a storefront, and that storefront has different gold coin packages. You can purchase— you just click on— I think we have six or seven right now. We have one where it’s only gold coins. It’s a couple of bucks. You click on it and it takes you to a screen that essentially is a purchase screen. You put in your purchase information and we work with American banking institutions.

We don’t have cryptocurrency. This is all very transparent where any credit cards or check cards, you can pay with Google Pay, Apple Pay and just purchase those packages, similar to other social casino companies. If you want to redeem, it’s pretty easy. You go to the redeem part of the platform, and you redeem, and you can redeem back to those same payment methods.

Mike: Sounds pretty simple.

Nick: Somebody can sign up in one click. They can sign up through their email. They just have to verify that or Facebook. They’ll be in the poker lobby. They’ll see gold coins games, and they’ll be getting gold coins. They get gold coins every day. Then if they acquire sweeps coins, which you can do through purchasing gold coin packages, which comes with free sweeps coins, or you can get them daily or through other entries, and then there’s presumably an entirely separate lobby, which is the same, but now you’re playing with the sweeps coins.

Jon: Correct. The one difference is you can’t acquire sweeps coins. We can only give them to you as promotional currency. The way we do that, we have a daily bonus where you can just come every day, and every 24-hour period, we give you free gold coins and free sweeps coins. We give away both gold coins and sweeps coins in social giveaways. We give them away in free rolls.

Obviously, on the sweeps coin side, because we’re using a sweepstakes mechanic for redemption, we have to follow sweepstakes rules to the letter of the law. We have to offer people alternative method of entry where they can go and get a code from our site and then send in that code, and we give them free sweeps coins similar to other sweepstakes companies.

Mike: Of course, you can win them at the tables.

Jon: You can spin up both gold coins and sweeps coins at the table.

Mike: Let’s shift gears a bit. We’ve got the basics down of what Clubs Poker is and how to get started. Let’s talk a bit about the experience of playing. We’ll focus specifically on the poker side of things for now. One of the trends that we’ve seen in online poker is, with each year, more and more players are choosing to play on mobile devices rather than on desktop devices. How important do you think mobile is in terms of the mix between the two for the players that you see on Clubs?

Jon: Incredibly important. We have both a web-based platform and a mobile-based platform. 70% to 75% of our players play on mobile. When we design Clubs Poker, obviously, we have a design for web, but mobile is tricky. It’s a very limited real estate on that screen. You have to put a whole bunch of stuff in there. Kudos to the design and product people at the GG Poker and PokerStars. I think they’ve done a great job.

We’ve tried to do our best to allow people to play on mobile, whether it’s playing with multitabling, which is super tough on mobile, super tough, but obviously have the ability to do it in a very simple and elegant way so you know where you are on that mobile phone.

Mike: One of the things that I discovered when playing on my mobile phone is that I was really reliant on the sounds to tell me where I was at on the different tables. How are the audio prompts and clues integrated into the poker game?

Jon: We spend so much time on audio, our head of UIUX, Dennis, and I, and the rest of the team, because if the audio is wrong, if a chime sounds exactly the same as when it’s your time to act versus when it’s somebody else’s time to act, it’s hard to know what’s going on. It’s vitally important. It’s like a movie. I was watching Rudy the other day, and the sound was off. It just wasn’t the same. With the beautiful score at the end, it’s not the same.

When you put the score on it, it enhances it and makes it better. Obviously, that stuff is so important. Where you put buttons, where you put your bet scroller, can you feel it on a mobile device with your thumb? Do you lose that touch, if you will, that can be— One thing can go wrong and you lose the ability for a user to play coherently on these sites. Look, we are constantly trying to improve these things. By no means are we perfect, but our goal is to continue to really enhance the product.

We take a lot of feedback. We work with influencers all the time. We have digital meetup games with a variety of influencers. We have takeover tournaments where influencers take over our tournaments. Not only is that really cool because they can talk about it with their audience and get people on our site to play, but also this group has been so thoughtful to us in terms of feedback, and we very quickly incorporated their feedback into our platform.

Nick: Something you said right at the start was just how many different poker variants like Clubs Poker supported out of the door. Beyond the big ones, you have a lot of the niche ones like Stud and Badugi and that kind of thing. That’s crazy for a company that’s only been around a year and a site that’s only launched for two weeks. That’s probably more games than a lot of, poker sites that have been around for years.

Both just from the development standpoint of getting that many games out and also from just having that many different tables and getting games running and getting liquidity going, could you just talk a bit about your decision to go so broad in your offerings right from the start?

Jon: There are a lot of good poker sites out there that have years of experience in development and products, and it’s very difficult to recreate a poker site and bring something to the masses that is differentiated. When we did our competitive analysis, what we saw here in America, at least, was that although there are alternatives to play on poker and some are very good, the one thing that, at least for me, I didn’t see was some of these more distinct, non-traditional games.

If we can do that and go to market with that, that’s one point of differentiation that we can market and really leverage that to grow. That was really it. We’ve seen the fruits of that strategy. We have like an Octamix game, both an Octamix ring game and a tournament where it’s eight games and it’s anything— We can do a Badugi, a Big O, a Deuce to Seven Triple Draw, a Omaha 6 Hi-Lo. The different combinations that we can do are fantastic. A lot of our influencers who play a lot love it.

They sit there and they play both on the ring games and the tournament. This is an area that we really try to promote. It’s an area that we’re going to continue to leverage to try to break into people’s hearts and minds so they can give us a try.

Mike: Are these poker variants available all the time in both ring games and tournaments?

Jon: We have them available all the time. We put up different games based on the demand. We do have a Badugi tournament running today and every day. When it comes to short deck poker, we have that. We haven’t put it on yet. We don’t want a whole bunch of tables that are just sitting there. We’ll either put them up if we have a demand for it, or influencers are requesting it. As we grow, again, I think we’ll just have a lot of optionality to switch around that poker room so we can talk to different sets of poker players.

Mike: We’ve talked a bit about the types of games that are available. One thing in my eyes that stands out at Clubs Poker is just the depth of the features. Tell us about your thoughts that went into bringing those to market.

Jon: I’m a poker player and I love Bomb Pots. I always want to rabbit hunt. When I’m playing in games with my buddies at home, we want to run it twice if it’s a big pot. Again, it’s not rocket science. We took what we love and what we know our friends love. This is our key demographic. Again, casual poker players who maybe weren’t online playing because they didn’t think there was an option to just go and emulate that experience that they’re playing with their friends.

That’s really what it was. We have a whole bunch of stuff, Run it Twice, Bomb Pots, rabbit hunting. We have the Deuce 7 game, which is pretty cool. We haven’t actually promoted it yet, but we have it. Then we have cool things. I live next to Parks Casino, 20 minutes away, which is one of the biggest casinos here in Pennsylvania. During the weekends, when their Bad Beat Jackpot gets to $200,000, $300,000, $400,000, you just want to go and sit there. That’s pretty cool. We have a Bad Beat Jackpot, both for GC and SC mode, and I think it just got hit yesterday or two days ago.

These are the types of things. Again, we wanted people to feel like they were getting what they love when they play with their friends or when they go to the casinos. We feel like we’ve done an okay job doing that at this point.

Mike: I saw that that hit the other day. I was actually a little bit surprised that the threshold was so low. I think it was full house over full house.

Jon: It’s aces, full house over full house, aces over ten is full house. Look, I hate it when you go into the Bad Beat Jackpot. It’s like quad jacks have to be beat. This is the biggest lottery ticket you’ve ever seen. Again, early on, we just want to make it fun for players both on GC and SC mode. That means lowering the threshold so it gets hit a little bit more.

Nick: Let’s transition then to just talking about how things are going. You’ve been live two months now. how has the first two months been? How’s it gone? Has it exceeded your expectations?

Jon: I have locked the expectations, Nick, and look, running and building companies, it’s not for the faint of heart. There’s obviously been a lot of challenges getting to this point, but I can say that over the first two months, I think that the results have exceeded my expectations. I think that the platform itself has been relatively well received by the poker player community, just from a product perspective, how it looks, how it feels, our depth of offerings and features and games.

That to me, when you’re sitting there on your computer with your developers and designers, and you’re just like, “Are people going to like this or is this going to be dead on arrival?” I think it was great to see a positive feedback from the community. We’re seeing every day more and more people on our site. Yesterday we had 600 people on the site at the same time which, if you think about poker, it’s tough to generate that liquidity. The whole point is you got to get people there at the same time. That’s super tough.

I think we’re well on our way to doing it. We’ve increased our daily active users. We’ve increased our guarantees for both gold coin mode and sweeps coins mode over the last eight weeks. Things are trending upwards. We have a great relationship with Hustler Casino Live where we’re one of their key sponsors. We run every day at 10:00 PM Eastern, 7:00 PM Pacific, a Hustler free roll, where for both GCs and SCs, you can go and just play for free and win coins.

Hustler’s been a fantastic partner and promoted that and love promoting that for their users as well. Overall, I think it’s been really positive and our goal is to continue to, I think, just be an advocate for the consumer, continue to do the right things, and continue to grow here in America.

Nick: Is there anything that maybe wasn’t on your radar that’s been a real surprise from listening to players, from seeing activity in the last two months that you’re like, “Okay, this needs to get on the product roadmap,” or has it changed your direction at all or your year’s strategy?

Jon: Yes, I think one of the things that players were telling us was mystery bounty tournaments. This is an innovation that, obviously PokerStars is doing this right now, and GG Poker, or the WSOP. It’s awesome. It’s a tough engineering challenge. This is one of the things that we are going to go live with very soon. Again, just a fun experience for consumers. Then going back to the mixed games, I think the level of interest for mixed games has surprised us.

Sometimes you just think it’s like my dad and his 80-year-old poker buddies, but a lot of great players, a lot of casual players love playing, Deuce to Seven Triple Draw. They love playing Razz. Razz is a really fun game. I’ve been in a couple of Razz tournaments. It sucks the life out of me a little bit, but it’s really cool to see the positive feedback we’ve got on those mixed games as well.

Mike: I play on the site. I started and I was playing No Limit Hold’em and I started sitting in some of the mixed games and I don’t know that I’ve gone back to No Limit Hold’em on the site in a while.

Jon: It’s awesome. I love it.

Mike: What does the future look like? One of the things that we’ve seen some evolution in the two months that you’ve been operating is in the tournament schedule, three rolls specifically. What’s in the future for that?

Jon: Our immediate future will be as we continue to grow, have bigger, bolder tournaments. That comes in the form of bigger guarantees, different structures. We do mostly turbos right now, but deep stacks as well. It’s really important that we continue to grow and get people on the site and stay with us. Then obviously when we have guarantees, hopefully, that will be an incentive for people to come as well. That’s going to be a big area for us.

Then just I would say, constantly improving all of the things that maybe people don’t see. That’s all the stuff that makes it very difficult to run these types of companies. It’s your customer service. We want to be the best in customer service. If you have a problem, we aspire to solve that problem quickly and make a bad customer experience a good one. That’s something that is very near and dear to our hearts.

Continue to double down on responsible gaming, that this is key to us. Again, we have a lot of experiences coming from the regulated world and adapting our tools and our processes to really meet those demands on the RG front. Look, I’d say it’s still early, but just continue to take feedback from consumers and make our product better. We’re 60 days into this. We have a long way to go.

Not only just on the product side but also just getting into the headspace of consumers who love playing a game of poker throughout America, it’s hard to build a new consumer brand. Our goal in the next four to six months will be to try to be one of the real key leaders, premier national American online poker sites.

Mike: You broke a little bit of news earlier with “Mystery Bounty is coming soon.”

Jon: Coming soon.

Mike: Yes, coming soon.

Jon: Stay tuned.

Mike: I’m wondering if you can break some more news. What about tournament series and trophies? Is that on your radar?

Jon: It is. It is on our radar. We have something that we’re probably going to announce next week. I’ll give you a little teaser. It’s the highest guaranteed tournament that we have. Then probably as we come into football season, we’re going to start putting together a series. We’re working on all that stuff now.

Mike: Great. What about features? You have so many features right now, I can’t imagine, of what you might want to add. Is there anything on the roadmap with regard to adding features to the product?

Jon: Yes, I would say that there’s always things that we’re trying to do on the product side. We’re also trying to do things on, I’ll call it the ops, the user experience side. We’re always trying to think about what is an easier way for people, can we add a payment mechanism. Right now we have credit cards, we have check cards, we have Google Pay, we have Apple Pay. Is there anything else we can do to make it easier for people to transact on our platform?

Our thinking is it’s not just the product, it’s the overall user experience. Can we remove friction anywhere to just get people to play and have fun and play with the gold coins that we give them? It’s a constant battle for us to maximize, I’ll call it the elegance of our site and make it so that consumers don’t have a reason to leave us if they tried us once.

Mike: Another area where listeners might be interested to know is, are there any live events on the radar? Could we see Clubs Poker come into our local casino or to our local convention center? Is there any plans in the work for bringing people together in the real world?

Jon: Not yet. We’re going to focus on the digital for a while, but look, I remember WPT just living at the Bellagio in Vegas and having our live events there back in 2006, 2007, how powerful it was to have those live events. We didn’t have it at the time, but combined that with online. PokerStars has been doing this forever, GG Poker. Look, we understand a lot of the value here in figuring how to combine these two assets, both digital and live tournaments, but nothing on the horizon for us just yet.

Mike: Nick, do you have anything more?

Nick: No, I think that’s a great place to wrap things up.

Mike: Perfect. Jon, thank you once again for joining us. It was very informative. I hope that you find some time to come back and break some more news when that is appropriate.

Jon: Absolutely. Mike and Nick, thank you for your time. Appreciate it.

Mike: Thanks.

That wraps up this episode of the Pokerfuse Podcast. As a reminder, please give us a like and a subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. You can also follow us and interact with us on Twitter. Nick is @PokerProJones. I’m @SpookyBugs. Thanks everyone for tuning in.